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	<title>Comments on: Wow, so, listen to this.</title>
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	<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/</link>
	<description>no one makes it out alive</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 12:32:47 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Cetta</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3232</link>
		<dc:creator>Cetta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Nov 2008 10:34:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3232</guid>
		<description>The pastor is definitely a manipulator, that's for sure. Just because you're Christian doesn't mean you have to follow everyone with a clerical collar around their neck. Part of being a Christian is to know the wolves in sheep's clothing, right?

Usually churches stick together too. Remember that one story of the pastor that was a child molester a while or so ago? The whole church stuck by him until the end because they BELIEVED in him. Turns out he was guilty though.

My point? If they're not believing in the pastor of the church -- the leader of the church -- or sticking by the man, then something right there tells me something big time is wrong.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The pastor is definitely a manipulator, that&#8217;s for sure. Just because you&#8217;re Christian doesn&#8217;t mean you have to follow everyone with a clerical collar around their neck. Part of being a Christian is to know the wolves in sheep&#8217;s clothing, right?</p>
<p>Usually churches stick together too. Remember that one story of the pastor that was a child molester a while or so ago? The whole church stuck by him until the end because they BELIEVED in him. Turns out he was guilty though.</p>
<p>My point? If they&#8217;re not believing in the pastor of the church &#8212; the leader of the church &#8212; or sticking by the man, then something right there tells me something big time is wrong.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Silverman</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3181</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Silverman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 23:41:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3181</guid>
		<description>You said on your blog:

What does someone supposedly molesting their daughter have to do with half the congregation leaving a church? Unless those people saw something else going on that they didn’t like…

I think this is a great point! If people left, they had to have had a reason. If I was the reason, then I was in jail at the time and no threat to anyone (if I was ever a threat). So why did they leave? According to some that I have talked to, they left because they felt that the pastor was a manipulator and that the church was heading toward behaving like a cult. My incarceration may have caused people to re-evaluate why they were there, but ultimately they left for other reasons.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You said on your blog:</p>
<p>What does someone supposedly molesting their daughter have to do with half the congregation leaving a church? Unless those people saw something else going on that they didn’t like…</p>
<p>I think this is a great point! If people left, they had to have had a reason. If I was the reason, then I was in jail at the time and no threat to anyone (if I was ever a threat). So why did they leave? According to some that I have talked to, they left because they felt that the pastor was a manipulator and that the church was heading toward behaving like a cult. My incarceration may have caused people to re-evaluate why they were there, but ultimately they left for other reasons.</p>
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		<title>By: Cetta</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3139</link>
		<dc:creator>Cetta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 04:02:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3139</guid>
		<description>I understand that whole rationale. But lying, as your wife and ex pastor are doing, is blatantly against their own God and their own religion. She's a hero of the faith? If she was she would have kept her family together, would have prayed for you, gently tried to nudge you back into it, etc. There are PLENTY of people who are wholeheartedly Christian with kids who are Christian and a spouse who is not. I've read tons of articles about wives and husbands asking what should they do for their unbelieving spouse, the answer always being to pray for them, to try to discuss with them, etc. But never &lt;strong&gt;ever&lt;/strong&gt; this.

Thou shall not bear false witness, right?

There is also nothing in the Bible that commands believers to NOT be married to unbelievers as far as I know. So doing what she is ... there is no purpose for it.

She should have used this as an opportunity to show her kids that the world is a big place, and there is going to be unbelievers out there as well, and you can still be close to them too. If her parents weren't Christian, would she cut them off?

Your parents apparently aren't Christian. Did you cut them off? Did you not let your kids around them? Or did you and tell your kids that even though they don't believe in Christ it's okay to love them anyway?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I understand that whole rationale. But lying, as your wife and ex pastor are doing, is blatantly against their own God and their own religion. She&#8217;s a hero of the faith? If she was she would have kept her family together, would have prayed for you, gently tried to nudge you back into it, etc. There are PLENTY of people who are wholeheartedly Christian with kids who are Christian and a spouse who is not. I&#8217;ve read tons of articles about wives and husbands asking what should they do for their unbelieving spouse, the answer always being to pray for them, to try to discuss with them, etc. But never <strong>ever</strong> this.</p>
<p>Thou shall not bear false witness, right?</p>
<p>There is also nothing in the Bible that commands believers to NOT be married to unbelievers as far as I know. So doing what she is &#8230; there is no purpose for it.</p>
<p>She should have used this as an opportunity to show her kids that the world is a big place, and there is going to be unbelievers out there as well, and you can still be close to them too. If her parents weren&#8217;t Christian, would she cut them off?</p>
<p>Your parents apparently aren&#8217;t Christian. Did you cut them off? Did you not let your kids around them? Or did you and tell your kids that even though they don&#8217;t believe in Christ it&#8217;s okay to love them anyway?</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Silverman</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3138</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Silverman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 03:33:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3138</guid>
		<description>Don't they think of the kids? Yes! And that is the problem. Let's look at it from this perspective (and I know this could be the case because I lived in this kind of an environment): If you believe that the eternal destination of each person on planet earth depends on their honest acceptance of Jesus as their savior and, in your own house, you have someone living there that does not believe that, then could you not come to the conclusion that this person presents a danger to the children? Does not the unbeliever offer the children a chance to reject Christ rather than to accept him? 

With this in mind, my wife is behaving as any mother that desires to protect her children. In fact, from her perspective, she is willing to suffer now, in this life, that she and her children will have the prospect of a glorious afterlife. 

If you believed, with all your heart, that heaven was real, that Christ was the only way and that this way was achieved through absolute faith, then would you not do all you could to give your own children a chance to have this faith? Would you not oppose any that would try to steal that chance away?

For those of us that do not believe like this, then we see her actions as irrational and crazy, even harmful to the children. But, from her perspective, she is a warrior doing all she can to guarantee a chance for the eternal survival of her children.

There are many within the fundamental circles in which I traveled that are most likely looking upon my wife as a hero of the faith.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don&#8217;t they think of the kids? Yes! And that is the problem. Let&#8217;s look at it from this perspective (and I know this could be the case because I lived in this kind of an environment): If you believe that the eternal destination of each person on planet earth depends on their honest acceptance of Jesus as their savior and, in your own house, you have someone living there that does not believe that, then could you not come to the conclusion that this person presents a danger to the children? Does not the unbeliever offer the children a chance to reject Christ rather than to accept him? </p>
<p>With this in mind, my wife is behaving as any mother that desires to protect her children. In fact, from her perspective, she is willing to suffer now, in this life, that she and her children will have the prospect of a glorious afterlife. </p>
<p>If you believed, with all your heart, that heaven was real, that Christ was the only way and that this way was achieved through absolute faith, then would you not do all you could to give your own children a chance to have this faith? Would you not oppose any that would try to steal that chance away?</p>
<p>For those of us that do not believe like this, then we see her actions as irrational and crazy, even harmful to the children. But, from her perspective, she is a warrior doing all she can to guarantee a chance for the eternal survival of her children.</p>
<p>There are many within the fundamental circles in which I traveled that are most likely looking upon my wife as a hero of the faith.</p>
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		<title>By: Cetta</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3137</link>
		<dc:creator>Cetta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 03:14:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3137</guid>
		<description>That's a very &lt;strong&gt;real&lt;/strong&gt; fear. Your wife and ex pastor are playing a dangerous game because CHILDREN are involved. Don't they think of the kids?

They are totally going against their own religion by doing this. So much so that your wife might as well divorce you since she isn't following her own religion to begin with.

Here's hoping they see your comment about the kids on this blog and wake up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s a very <strong>real</strong> fear. Your wife and ex pastor are playing a dangerous game because CHILDREN are involved. Don&#8217;t they think of the kids?</p>
<p>They are totally going against their own religion by doing this. So much so that your wife might as well divorce you since she isn&#8217;t following her own religion to begin with.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s hoping they see your comment about the kids on this blog and wake up.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Silverman</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3128</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Silverman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 23:42:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3128</guid>
		<description>My fear is that my children will become mentally harmed by all of this. Because of the accusation and the protective order my wife placed against me, I have not been able to see or talk to any of my children since September 8th. This means they have had over two months of continued brainwashing. If my wife was willing to tell my children that I was an anti-Christ and deluded while I was still in the house, what is she telling them now that I cannot even speak to them?

Even if I am found not guilty by the court, I still have to go through a battle with Social Services. As it is right now, they will only allow me supervised visits with my kids and they have not even set up the first one yet. I have talked to them and they keep telling me things like, "next week" and "it takes time".</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My fear is that my children will become mentally harmed by all of this. Because of the accusation and the protective order my wife placed against me, I have not been able to see or talk to any of my children since September 8th. This means they have had over two months of continued brainwashing. If my wife was willing to tell my children that I was an anti-Christ and deluded while I was still in the house, what is she telling them now that I cannot even speak to them?</p>
<p>Even if I am found not guilty by the court, I still have to go through a battle with Social Services. As it is right now, they will only allow me supervised visits with my kids and they have not even set up the first one yet. I have talked to them and they keep telling me things like, &#8220;next week&#8221; and &#8220;it takes time&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3125</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 22:03:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3125</guid>
		<description>She already is nuts.
But it probably will force the kids away from religion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>She already is nuts.<br />
But it probably will force the kids away from religion.</p>
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		<title>By: Cetta</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3124</link>
		<dc:creator>Cetta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 21:58:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3124</guid>
		<description>I hope it blows up in her face and the kids become detached from their religion. She'll only have herself to blame. Hope she goes nuts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hope it blows up in her face and the kids become detached from their religion. She&#8217;ll only have herself to blame. Hope she goes nuts.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3123</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 21:32:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3123</guid>
		<description>The whole world's going crazy. I'm sure this isn't the first time something like this has happened. People become too absorbed in their religious ideology and forget about reality. Honestly, I feel most bad for his children. It definitely sucks for him that his wife is a psycho, but it's gotta be even worse for the kids. 
Remember that conversation we had about environmental influences changing people? Well, this is definitely that instance. It's hard to say where those kids will end up. Either devote crazy Christians, or completely detached from the religion. 
I honestly don't understand how people become so absorbed in religion... I was raised Catholic, and it never stuck hahah. Then again, it wasn't forced down my throat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The whole world&#8217;s going crazy. I&#8217;m sure this isn&#8217;t the first time something like this has happened. People become too absorbed in their religious ideology and forget about reality. Honestly, I feel most bad for his children. It definitely sucks for him that his wife is a psycho, but it&#8217;s gotta be even worse for the kids.<br />
Remember that conversation we had about environmental influences changing people? Well, this is definitely that instance. It&#8217;s hard to say where those kids will end up. Either devote crazy Christians, or completely detached from the religion.<br />
I honestly don&#8217;t understand how people become so absorbed in religion&#8230; I was raised Catholic, and it never stuck hahah. Then again, it wasn&#8217;t forced down my throat.</p>
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		<title>By: Cetta</title>
		<link>http://ritualistic.org/2008/11/20/wow-so-listen-to-this/#comment-3113</link>
		<dc:creator>Cetta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 14:12:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ritualistic.org/?p=2364#comment-3113</guid>
		<description>That's what my friend Danny said too. He's Christian and he said people like this give Christianity a bad name.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s what my friend Danny said too. He&#8217;s Christian and he said people like this give Christianity a bad name.</p>
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